• What Media Bias?

    From BTR1701@3:633/10 to All on Thu Oct 16 17:36:52 2025
    New York Times headline: The Supreme Court Case That Could Hand the House to the Republicans

    First of all, NY Times, Gray Lady, Guardian of Truth, who exactly do you think holds the House right now?

    And if you know the answer to that question how could a SCOTUS opinion "hand control" to any party other than the Democrats?

    Which brings me to the second point: If the only way you can win is by having someone put their thumb on the scale, then maybe you?re not really winning.



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    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)
  • From Adam H. Kerman@3:633/10 to All on Thu Oct 16 19:02:20 2025
    BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:

    New York Times headline: The Supreme Court Case That Could Hand the House to >the Republicans

    First of all, NY Times, Gray Lady, Guardian of Truth, who exactly do you think >holds the House right now?

    And if you know the answer to that question how could a SCOTUS opinion "hand >control" to any party other than the Democrats?

    Which brings me to the second point: If the only way you can win is by having >someone put their thumb on the scale, then maybe you?re not really winning.

    Can you please explain to me why Republicans in recent decades bitch
    nonstop about the Voting Rights Act? The Voting Rights Act was a blunt instrument when flexibility in protecting minority voting rights was
    required. Single-member districts was the one-size-fits-all solution,
    and these have just gotten more gerrymandered over time with more and
    more powerful computers able to put together exactly the right
    conbination of census blocks -- even if conpactness is enforced -- to
    make election outcones predictable and unconpetitive for the next two
    cycles.

    Putting together minority voters in a district with a supermajority (55%
    for black, 60% for Hispanic because of the number of Mexican foreign
    nationals; these percentages were in use for years) does not ensure ward heelers and race baiters won't rise to the top of the heap.

    If the Voting Rights Act had always allowed multi-member districts,
    which various federal court rulings have effectively prevented, then "minority", however defined, could vote as a bloc for whatever their
    special interest is, race/ethnicity, some narrow issue of concern, or
    party. If there were, say, three to be elected, two seats would go to
    the "majority" or largest plurality, and one to the "minority" voting as
    a bloc.

    The air quotes are because, despite what those who know best think,
    racial and ethnic "looks like me" representation are not always the
    primary concern of voters. On occassion, some want quality
    representation.

    My state used to have cumulative voting for members of the House of Representatives in the state legislature. There were three members to be elected. A voter had three votes and could give three to one candidate,
    1 1/2 votes to each of two candidates, two votes to one candidate and
    one vote to another, or one vote to each of three candidates. This
    guaranteed a Republican could be elected from a heavily Democratic
    district in Chicago and a Democrat could be elected in a Republican
    majority district in the suburbs or downstate. It actually made it
    easier to form coalitions for legislation as geograohical interests
    often overcame party interests, and individual legislators had the power
    and leadership did not. The "reform" led to four decades of Mike
    Madigan, with single-member districts. He just reported to prison.

    Uh, I've heard a rumor that voters in other states have higher
    expectations of their elected officials than voters in my states.

    The bitching and moaning I'm pointoing out? Republicans literally made
    huge chunis of the country uncompetitve and benefitted by packing
    minority districts with Democrats, and making the rest of the state
    competitive for Republicans and uncompetitive for Democrats,

    If not for certain sections of the VOting Rights Act, the complete
    Republican domination of huge parts of the country wouldn't have
    happened.

    In my state, they took the same computer programs and figured out how to
    pack certain districts with Republicans so heavily that they are
    uncompetive everywhere else. As this is manipulating white voters, no
    protected class violation in the Voting Rights Act.

    This is the worst legacy of the John Roberts court, not that chunks of
    the Voting Rights Act may be a reverse discrimination equal protection violation but because gerrymandering is political and federal courts
    have no say. The cure for gerrymandering is... Well you have to throw the bastards out which can't be done given redistricting, which to cure you
    have to throw the bastards out, which can't be done due to redistricting,
    which to cure...

    Roberts makes me miss Reinquist.

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    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)
  • From Pluted Pup@3:633/10 to All on Thu Oct 16 19:14:24 2025
    On 10/16/25 10:36 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
    New York Times headline: The Supreme Court Case That Could Hand the House to the Republicans

    First of all, NY Times, Gray Lady, Guardian of Truth, who exactly do you think
    holds the House right now?

    And if you know the answer to that question how could a SCOTUS opinion "hand control" to any party other than the Democrats?

    Which brings me to the second point: If the only way you can win is by having someone put their thumb on the scale, then maybe you?re not really winning.

    The unmentioned substance of the article is urging the
    passage of California Prop. 50, which is intended to increase
    the majority party representation in Congress from 83% to 96%.

    From already a century's worth of gerrymandering the minority
    party has been reduced to 17% or 9 out of 52 representatives
    while the legislature initiated Prop 50 is scheduled to reduce
    the ratio to 2 in 52.

    Look at the polls, the real polls, the California voters have
    never come close to a voting pattern of 83% Democratic
    to 17% Republican, much less 96% Democratic to 4% Republican.

    Despite the obnoxious saturation ads advocating voting no on 50,
    that's what I'll do.




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    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)
  • From The Horny Goat@3:633/10 to All on Fri Oct 17 10:18:27 2025
    On Thu, 16 Oct 2025 19:02:20 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
    <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

    Can you please explain to me why Republicans in recent decades bitch
    nonstop about the Voting Rights Act? The Voting Rights Act was a blunt >instrument when flexibility in protecting minority voting rights was >required. Single-member districts was the one-size-fits-all solution,
    and these have just gotten more gerrymandered over time with more and
    more powerful computers able to put together exactly the right
    conbination of census blocks -- even if conpactness is enforced -- to
    make election outcones predictable and unconpetitive for the next two
    cycles.

    Thanks for an interesting primer on something I (who have taken part
    as a party poll representative in Canadian elections) am quite
    interested in. I knew the US system was more complex than the Canadian
    system with respect to the breakdown of districts after each 10 year
    census cycle but didn't know the specifics.

    I also knew what gerrymandering was but not in nearly the detail you
    explained it.

    --- PyGate Linux v1.0
    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)
  • From Adam H. Kerman@3:633/10 to All on Fri Oct 17 19:34:23 2025
    The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca> wrote:
    Thu, 16 Oct 2025 19:02:20 -0000 (UTC), Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com>:

    Can you please explain to me why Republicans in recent decades bitch >>nonstop about the Voting Rights Act? The Voting Rights Act was a blunt >>instrument when flexibility in protecting minority voting rights was >>required. Single-member districts was the one-size-fits-all solution,
    and these have just gotten more gerrymandered over time with more and
    more powerful computers able to put together exactly the right
    conbination of census blocks -- even if conpactness is enforced -- to
    make election outcones predictable and unconpetitive for the next two >>cycles.

    Thanks for an interesting primer on something I (who have taken part
    as a party poll representative in Canadian elections) am quite
    interested in. I knew the US system was more complex than the Canadian
    system with respect to the breakdown of districts after each 10 year
    census cycle but didn't know the specifics.

    I also knew what gerrymandering was but not in nearly the detail you >explained it.

    Gerrymandering is about as anti-democratic as it gets, allowing a
    computer to choose the constituency to damn well make sure the
    constituency doesn't face the prosepct of an unpredictable outcome.

    --- PyGate Linux v1.0
    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)
  • From BTR1701@3:633/10 to All on Fri Oct 17 19:39:08 2025
    On Oct 17, 2025 at 12:34:23 PM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com>
    wrote:

    The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca> wrote:
    Thu, 16 Oct 2025 19:02:20 -0000 (UTC), Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com>:

    Can you please explain to me why Republicans in recent decades bitch
    nonstop about the Voting Rights Act? The Voting Rights Act was a blunt
    instrument when flexibility in protecting minority voting rights was
    required. Single-member districts was the one-size-fits-all solution,
    and these have just gotten more gerrymandered over time with more and
    more powerful computers able to put together exactly the right
    conbination of census blocks -- even if conpactness is enforced -- to
    make election outcones predictable and unconpetitive for the next two
    cycles.

    Thanks for an interesting primer on something I (who have taken part
    as a party poll representative in Canadian elections) am quite
    interested in. I knew the US system was more complex than the Canadian
    system with respect to the breakdown of districts after each 10 year
    census cycle but didn't know the specifics.

    I also knew what gerrymandering was but not in nearly the detail you
    explained it.

    Gerrymandering is about as anti-democratic as it gets, allowing a
    computer to choose the constituency to damn well make sure the
    constituency doesn't face the prosepct of an unpredictable outcome.

    And it's only getting worse now that AI engines have entered the arena.



    --- PyGate Linux v1.0
    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)
  • From shawn@3:633/10 to All on Fri Oct 17 18:13:38 2025
    On Fri, 17 Oct 2025 19:39:08 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com>
    wrote:

    On Oct 17, 2025 at 12:34:23 PM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com> >wrote:

    The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca> wrote:
    Thu, 16 Oct 2025 19:02:20 -0000 (UTC), Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com>:

    Can you please explain to me why Republicans in recent decades bitch
    nonstop about the Voting Rights Act? The Voting Rights Act was a blunt >>>> instrument when flexibility in protecting minority voting rights was
    required. Single-member districts was the one-size-fits-all solution,
    and these have just gotten more gerrymandered over time with more and
    more powerful computers able to put together exactly the right
    conbination of census blocks -- even if conpactness is enforced -- to
    make election outcones predictable and unconpetitive for the next two
    cycles.

    Thanks for an interesting primer on something I (who have taken part
    as a party poll representative in Canadian elections) am quite
    interested in. I knew the US system was more complex than the Canadian
    system with respect to the breakdown of districts after each 10 year
    census cycle but didn't know the specifics.

    I also knew what gerrymandering was but not in nearly the detail you
    explained it.

    Gerrymandering is about as anti-democratic as it gets, allowing a
    computer to choose the constituency to damn well make sure the
    constituency doesn't face the prosepct of an unpredictable outcome.

    And it's only getting worse now that AI engines have entered the arena.


    It's just too easy. We've had the perfect example of the old style
    with Fulton county for decades. It extends over much of the metro
    Atlanta area with an extremely slim middle to make sure it encompasses
    just the areas with large numbers of black voters. I can't imagine
    what would get drawn when you bring in software programs that can thru
    millions of potential options to find the perfect option.

    --- PyGate Linux v1.0
    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)
  • From The Horny Goat@3:633/10 to All on Sat Oct 18 19:30:41 2025
    On Fri, 17 Oct 2025 19:34:23 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
    <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

    I also knew what gerrymandering was but not in nearly the detail you >>explained it.

    Gerrymandering is about as anti-democratic as it gets, allowing a
    computer to choose the constituency to damn well make sure the
    constituency doesn't face the prosepct of an unpredictable outcome.

    Mr Gerry was of course long before the computer era (mid-19th century)
    but no question computers make figuring out which neighborhoods the gerrymanderer most wants in his district and which he doesn't - and
    making sure he gets the most possible from column 1 and the least from
    column 2.

    Computers only do it faster and more accurately - there are all kinds
    of cases where gerrymandered districts have come in with "unexpected"
    results. This has been true in pretty much every western country where
    this sort of thing has gone on.

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